Imaginary Reality, Real-World Consequences

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In this thought-provoking session titled "Gaming: Imaginary Reality, Real-World Consequences," we delve into how the dynamic interplay of gaming, AI, and Web3 technologies is revolutionizing the landscape of entertainment. Experts will unpack trends in immersive experiences and the implications of gaming innovations for creativity, ownership, and social interaction. Attendees will gain valuable insights into the potential challenges and opportunities presented by these advancements, addressing critical issues such as cyberthreats and mental health.

Join our distinguished panel of experts:
- Mike Butcher (Moderator), Editor-at-large, TechCrunch: A pioneering journalist in European technology, advising governments and startups.
- Ignat Bobrovich, CEO of Vavlur.GG | Esports.NGO: Renowned esports leader driving initiatives in digital wellbeing and cybersecurity.
- Mihaela Ulieru, Chief AI Alchemist at SingularityNET: Acclaimed researcher and advocate for inclusivity through Web3.
- Alina Nilsson, Managing Partner at Gamegroove Capital: Venture capitalist with a track record of mentoring startups in gaming and technology.
- Alan Lau, CBO of Animoca Brands: A leading figure in blockchain technology and community-building in the gaming industry.
- Sébastien Borget, Co-Founder & COO of The Sandbox: Innovator recognized for his contributions to the crypto and blockchain gaming landscape.
- Mete Al, Visionary Entrepreneur: Renowned for his expertise in blockchain and cryptocurrency, simplifying complex concepts for broad audiences. 

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Transcript

Transcript:
(00:01) [Music] hi everybody my name is Mike Butcher that's me um I'm a journalist and editor at TechCrunch Tech crunch uh writes about startups venture capital and big Tech we have about 20 million readers a month and uh I've been on the tech runch since about uh 14 72 during the medieval period that's a joke um a long time and we've got a nice panel we've had a couple of panel changes line up but we actually have a bigger panel for you now than we started so you're going to get even more value I think um and uh what we're going to be
(00:49) talking about here is sort of uh G as it says imagining reality imaginary reality real world consequences the idea being that uh gaming especially the convergence of AI gaming and web 3 are uh going to have on on people um as well as the industry itself because one of the big consequences of the convergence of what the the fact that AI can become both a kind of a creator of gaming and a player as well and uh gaming itself obviously has been around for many years and we're all familiar with the fact that you know you know games and um
(01:28) whether they be shoot them UPS or platform or strategy whatever it is and then the idea that digital assets also are something that you can actually own so you the gamer you you end up owning what you run run in the game not just being a player for Sony PlayStation where you don't own anything at all um and that's been going on for many years and it has obviously evolved um and it's just going to get bigger and bigger um and one of the most interesting move moves recently um is is um uh uh uh one of our guests who's just about to come
(02:05) up and explain uh what she's working on and she's one of the backers of this uh event game Grove Capital so a big hand for Elina from game G Grove thank you thank you Mike um so um I represent game Grove Capital I'm a managing partner there and uh Alina I'm alen nilson based in Sweden and uh we are honored to to partner up with Davis uh for this panel so our portfolio company uh gonzilla games has been doing AAA video games and it's they just released the first uh video game that has web 3 integration and uh it was released uh in October and
(02:47) since then we had over 12 million wallets created and so we are quite excited on the opportunities and like intersection uh between gaming and web 3 and on the VC side we invest not just in gaming but also in the technology for gaming along with web 3 and AI so I'm happy to pass on the mic to M thank you so much right we'll get the show on the road and we'll H leave a couple of minutes at the end to uh have some Q&A questions with the audience uh but let's first let's me first get our uh introduce our panel to you so I think my
(03:25) my notes are slightly in the wrong order but let's let's go with Ignat first Ignat uh you are with uh Val valur and Esports is a bit of a mouthful um just give us 30 seconds on who you are what you're working on there's a microphone next to you hello hello hello hello yeah hello everyone my name isan bovic uh I'm an orts veteran I was a professional player like 25 years ago uh for the last 10 years I'm working in the industry of Esports uh and um my idea was always to empower people through gaming and Competitive Gaming and orts I just
(04:03) recently released a book with pgri McMillian about Esports uh with the audience actually been parents teachers marketers investors to explain what is orts because I see lots of misconceptions there uh and in Valor is the project uh focused on cyber security uh for kids and parents in gaming so we are looking into the problematics of the Cyber threats from the aspects of actually protecting through building the trust and also providing technological setup from the from the technological setup we have a soul bone token uh and
(04:34) we have a PC encryption um to protect the assets for Mike was speaking about the assets and we believe it's important to protect them more than they protected now um yeah thank you so much great uh next up we have uh Maha um who is a chief AI Alchemist I love these job titles don't you um Chief Alchemist so you can turn uh metal into into base metal into gold is that right uh gray matter that's quite a gray matter I think that's a brain I'm not sure one that turned into a gold um we'll see into that so um uh you were a doctor I
(05:12) is that a medical or PhD I'm a professor of artificial intelligence professor of artificial intelligence so therefore researcher in E society and you're also president of the impact Institute for the digital economy focusing on transforming education in the digital landscape what else what up to now what's what's your latest 30 second update on what you're working on and Singularity so so one uh thing which is um U my passion is I call it gaming as uh the Hol as future work ground and the idea is how can we use the immersive
(05:47) environments to and you know which are engaging the wild enthusiasm of our youth of uh our society is how can we use that to harness them towards something productive and solving the big biggest challenges uh that are facing Humanity today this is what I'm doing okay amazing thank you next up Sebastian uh co-founder and CEO of the sandbox and um I think if you're certainly in web 3 or gaming you would have heard of the sandbox been around metaverse that's been around for a while and uh was very much a Pioneer in the
(06:22) space give us an update quickly uh Sebastian yes so for anyone who's not familiar sunbox is a decentralized virtual world like we've partnered with more than 400 Major Brands we've grown to over 6.3 million users uh over the last uh two months we had our high record breaking event that brought in over uh 580,000 unique players generated a million transaction on the blockchain and like people bought for over 350,000 nft so really proven that like engagement in the metaverse is strong like nfts is far from dead metav
(06:56) is far from dead and like with perseverance and like bringing great content bringing culture together and empowering Creator to build new form of experience and games like we can really Drive adoption forward um so that's like the the the ballpark about what we are doing at sandbox we'll have a lot of amazing news again this year in term of product update Community growing the ecosystem and growing sandbox beyond the virtual world so more to come about that and beside that I'm also the president of the blockchain game Alliance that's an
(07:26) association that now counts 600 members and our mission is to to promote the adoption of blockchain Technology within the video game industry right I want to ask you about that um next up we've got Alan La who's see Chief business officer is that right of animoo animoo Brands uh most famous for um that thing you what was it again yeah I we much for quite a few things so we're very early invested we we're invested in gonzilla actually and we're invested in sandbox right um and you know we've got 500 companies in the
(08:03) portfolio so I don't know which one you're you're thinking about right so we've got quite a few all the way back we also do Hello Kitty games but that's like Hello Kitty thank you very much the original gangsters um and so give us a 30 second update on what's happening with you and what's animok well great to be here thanks for showing up so early uh Alan CPO enoka so we're one of the most prolific investor and builder of web 3 um so you know as I said we're early investors in sandbox in ugal laabs in polygon immutable we also had a big
(08:33) gaming portfolio so we people think about animoca they mostly think about games about quarter of the 500 companies we had in the portfolio and games gonzilla is one of them U so that's why I think what you've mentioned Mike to to start with the idea that you know actually gaming industry in the past compan have gone through a lot of changes right just the idea of blockchain that allow people to use what they create is a is a big leap and then now we have ai which really changes both on the development side in terms of the
(08:58) speed and the agility you can develop games but also the possibility in terms of you know once you playing with intelligent being right you know the the amount of possibility to open up for gamers right so those are all things that we're active on Amazing great and last but not least we have uh meta is that right yes from ICB verse tell us give us a 30 second update yeah actually we we have our own blockchain network ICB blockchain we have uh our own um nft Marketplace and uh our own metaverse as well uh we are uh not doing metaverse
(09:33) for a gaming actually we are doing for a University academic city famous Hall and uh land of residence uh and U land of Legend as well so uh we are uh we are making all the university and a school for the student uh in a gaming uh feeling that's it right okay fine right well um to kick things off um well obviously um the gaming industry is absolutely massive at dwarfs Hollywood um we know what's happened with um uh the sort of the cryptocurrency aspect of web 3 um and the ownership aspect of web 3 and blockchain with uh nfts and assets
(10:18) digital assets um let me talk to uh Sebastian first of all given that your your role um your um you know the traditional video games industry probably views the that world as with a fairly that the idea of digital assets uh ownership with quite a skeptical eye is it um where is that conversation at this point in time given it's 24 2025 sorry my god um and I think also in the really interesting in the context of um Trump being elected and not to politicize things but obviously being so crypto friendly um uh uh the Trump coin
(11:01) the Melania coin um Trump uh his um cabinet is chalk full of tech CEOs and crypto people um do you think that that the whole conversation is going to shift now uh in in some wise all right so a few things to unfold here like first of all uh I do think like the video game industry has matured their understanding of what blockchain is and like now they see like the benefit of blockchain mostly for ownership and exploring new business model uh we've been running an industry survey for four years now at the BGA we just published a last result
(11:36) and for the third year consequently like ownership comes at the first reason why the industry is considering it and now people don't see like crypto as a scam anymore as just a way for speculation they like really interested to explore for the technology and it comes following like two years it's been like the worst for the video game industry like the amount of layoff that happen it all across the board Activision Unity Ubisoft Amazon that's down to the fact that um down to the fact no not not yet like we haven't seen like the impact of
(12:10) AI in the gaming sector and I can talk about like how it's more complimentary than replacing but more because like two things like privacy laws has like uh removed the ability for developer to Target specifically users so usually doing user acquisition uh but you were collecting data from the behavior of user to Target them and have a lower CPI and the second is like the usual like CPI cost per cost per install so basically lot of video game they have this business model called freeto playay or premium where like only one to 3% of
(12:41) user are buying the rest are consuming the product for free and you target specifically the user who are more likely to spend make them spend fully more than $100 in those game to make a profitable business model CPI have risen because you cannot Target any more users and unfortunately LTV lifetime value like the amount of money that players have been spending have been decreasing and decreasing many reason like right so that yeah so if you just truncate what you were going to say because we have a large panel we need to
(13:09) get through basically it's getting hard to make money in video game and be sustainable so what I'm trying to ask you is is web 3 now going to merge more with the video games industry it's going to be yes and like the opening uh the the new US president the Trump Co is probably going to Mark a wind change new area where us users uh will come in will spend again so basically yes and value will be created yeah great thank you Ignat you had a point yeah I wanted to add on that because like digital assets for gamers existed since '90s I mean uh
(13:46) when I was an orts player we had a digital asset of the liery of the car I was I was in Sim racing and now I mean I've I've heard a lot of already about the ownership of the of the assets and there is there's a big question right some big big guys big companies say that we own this and you don't know it we just give it to you and uh the web three and the decentralization is about giving this ownership but I come to the question that I think that ownership is a good idea but it should be fair because what happens for game developers
(14:12) and this is what just to continue to Sebastian's point I mean if the if the if the Publishers will not have a control over the business models they will not just be able to develop the games not being de able to develop the games they will not be able to deliver the content and it will be the industry can die in in the way we know it so I think about the owner ship so um there should be some proper way to found and I'm not sure that pure pure giv like hey big big guys are not giving you the ownership web3 will give the ownership I
(14:40) think it might be a bit of dangerous pass although definitely it's needed so it's it's a good way isn't the problem though that the gamers then have to have multiple wallets a problem for whom I mean most of the gamers are playing one game they have one game I don't think it's a problem I yeah I think if it's fun you know people will come right and I I think answering that question as well I think Trump's election is clearly a watershed moment I think a lot of people that's been sitting on the Seline will lean in because you know of course what
(15:11) the policy that's been set in the US will make it a lot more comfortable for the other jurisdiction to to follow suit right I mean to be clear gaming industry have always had a love relationship with blockchain since ever since they arrived there are people that lenient like ourselves and there is the Sony the Electronic Arts and all the other guys that's been secretly testing I mean I used to before animal car I used to work at 10 cent you know it's you know it's a it's a half a trillion dollar company huge in gaming but they never would say
(15:37) that they're in blockchain they would secretly invest and see the the plan you know see the investment in different games they're making investment they just don't want to be open about it right so I think what's happening in the US will change that because I think to Sebastian's point there is a lot of merits that come with the blockchain technology and the token incentive to come with it right instead of you know if you're a game instead of spending a lot of money on marketing now you can use the idea of a token to bring
(16:01) everyone in so you know they You're Building Community but at the same time you're not spending money on marketing you're actually making money from marketing like that is a real change but you know with all the reason that we all know very well I mean there's been a stigma around it and I think that's going to change right if I can add to that you got 10 seconds on this one all right game Studio are bringing players in they don't Focus too much on the tech there's blockchain companies that are focusing on like cross chain and all the
(16:24) technology to enable players to like like trade their token and exchange it back to fat or their currencies and do what they want after bringing ftual money to real world right meta uh Yes actually the from my idea uh digital asset and cryptocurrency will help a lot to the gaming uh but uh there is one point that uh we lost in a gaming section I'm telling you I'm not in a gaming part of web tree but uh there is one point that we needed in a game uh imagine about the Sony or uh apples they have a Marketplace but we don't
(17:04) have any Marketplace for uh gaming solution this is this is something uh somebody should work on it because uh the people the developer that are making some games here in on this Market uh they know how to sell coin token and nfts because there is lots of way to do do that but uh there isn't there isn't any Marketplace to uh show to The Gamers actually there is the a new game on this market right so finding uh web three games is may be an issue haa do you have a view on this subject this convergence of digital assets and gaming definitely
(17:42) as they were mentioning but from my perspective this is enabling everyone to tap into the wealth of the gaming yes the thing however uh referring to the title of our panel yes imaginary reality real world consequences and the Trump election MH it's going to be a wild ride and I think it's very important maybe to shift the Paradigm from the Zero Sum competitive engagement maybe to the you know wisdom sharing the gaming as a Synergy more like the Beehive uh Paradigm and I think that's very important for game developer and game
(18:18) designers because now everybody will have access and will tap into the weals but what are the consequences of that and that is I think we can we can take on from there with the mental health with the use are we going to accelerate with AI well I mean that's that's probably a good jumping off point actually because um we we've all seen that um gaming can be addictive social media is addictive obviously and we've all seen the gaming itself of course can be addictive we all familiar with the with the you know the 16-year-old in the
(18:51) basement playing games for hours and hours and this was even before uh the digital aspect asset aspect was was invented um is it going to make that addictive um those addictive possibilities um far far greater um and more con even more concerning you know some of us have kids I've got kids uh luckily they're old enough now to know better but certainly there was a point at which you know some some kind of you know kids can get very addicted to these things so do digital assets make addiction higher and uh greater um in gaming than previously
(19:36) and the tokens are incentivizing participation so you say yes it depends on how we design the game and that is the thing but usually games are designed to be addictive the game designers ever say Sebastian we obviously can't keep you quiet I know I'm I'm going to have a problem with you I'm addicted Go For It Go short answer no I don't want like people to feel like video game industry is more helpful because of blockchain and token inial asset it's just small proportion let's look at the bright picture the positive side like how many
(20:08) more million of people have been empowered through gaming through through digital ownership in what way the network effect this Collective Freedom the share Freedom NE that's not power though but it replace the Discovery Well I think like actually when we value that digital economy is more than virtual that physical economy when playing my Play Time can be become a way as well to gain new skills to educate myself to earn some form of Revenue to gain financial literacy it's very important for many countries in the world not just
(20:38) the developed European give me an example well like we've created million of job of sandbox people have been earning from $100 to several hundred or thousand creating game First Time creators they never made games before they discovered skills uh there was a movie made in a documentary movie in Philippine showing kids who never had access to school that were able to go to school and make video games thanks to s Bo people creating 3D asset all of that would have not been possible without digital ownership fa comment IGN yeah uh
(21:05) just wanted to add about this let mental health aspect in the ownership of the assets when we speak about the ownership it's great to get these assets right but what happens if they're stolen I mean the the security aspects are huge and no one is really covering this and when we speak about the blockchain it's easy to if the wallet is lost then the assets are lost and imagine the person the kid or whoever is investing tens hundreds of hours a week to develop this asset to get this and what happens when it's
(21:30) stolen we speak about this we want to empower the ownership but we don't speak about actually how we help to save it right and how we actually can work with this so for example from our side this is why we're saying hey cyber security is super important in this industry no one is really paying a lot of attention to that also if it's stolen is there is the possibility to get an insurance for this or is it possible to get to some police or some uh or game developer how does it work it's not there yet and here
(21:57) it this besides the add it creates the next layer which can become really important it's it's an addiction uh in square side it's Amplified addiction if I'm addicted to my account and it's stolen it can be a trategy for kid that's that well yeah I mean we people have young people have killed themselves uh after being addicted to games God knows what's going to happen if they if they lose thousands or millions of dollars in tokens as a result after playing a game and and they it's stolen or they lose it that I can't
(22:28) even even begin to think how awful that's going to be or or or has happened already for all we know does anim moo Brands think about I I have to say something about the addiction maybe before that you go first then we'll hear from bill so when it comes to the addiction yes um the um I'm a scientist and a cognitive scientist and uh how the brain works is it's sort of an in and yang and it depends on the incentives so what do you incentivize do you incentivize accumulation or do you consumption or do you incentivize
(23:01) collaboration for protein folding or for something useful right and like dungeon and Dragons for example it's more like wisdom game so the incentive issues yeah so if they are addicted to that I think that's much they won't kill themselves allocation or collection or whatever and how do you engage them towards what and I just have to say one more thing uh NASA has published a book which is called cosmological theories of value that postulates that values are Universal they are not relative however humanity is using values as relative
(23:34) everybody has their own and gaming is promoting values and those values can lead to addiction towards suicide or to addiction towards good perhaps they they're generous benefactors who have a great or good supposed to be provocative not all gaming is beneficial Animo about very interesting I think gaming is just a mirror to the world so you know I think disclaimer I came from a place where gaming is highly restricted I mean in China as you know that kids are only allowed to play games for certain number of hours it was it's a policy and you
(24:05) get fined and parents would get fine so actually if you're under a 16 if you want to play you need to have your parents register an ID and you enable your kid to play that right and and therefore in terms of money flow the parents would decide how much they get topped up and the kids will play with that amount of money so the reason why I say that is yes you know I don't think we figured it out on a blockchain how it's going to get worse or better because I don't think anyone has figured it out on the web 2 side either right so
(24:32) you know all those issue that you talk about whether there going to be addiction whether you're going to spend too much money I don't think anyone has figured it out right I so therefore but but I I do think that I don't think web through would make it worse in the same way that you know you don't have crypto falling from the sky you still need someone to top you up there still need to be some conversation if you're a kid with your parents and how much time you spend on it how much money you spend on it right so I don't think it make it
(24:56) worse but I I had an interesting experience with my kids when they when my 9-year-old racked up £5,000 on Plants versus Zombies um and why do you give him your credit card without on my credit card without me realizing because I thought I was stupid enough to think that maybe the game would put a cap on this and he was buying these powerups for like 75 a time like power up power up bing bang £5,000 later I I called up the game company I said hi I'm from Tech crunch um I'm a journalist uh are you going to help me
(25:34) out over there that was a short conversation um uh meta have you got you got a view on this subject yeah actually uh people uh they're going to addicted uh to the uh to the gaming uh we had them uh if you guys knows hamister uh in the Middle East everybody used that one it's a play to earn but it's not a game but everybody is everybody knows ham as a game and now we have something around thousand and thousand uh game on a telegram so people they are using these games and there's nothing behind of these games and uh we should take take
(26:16) care of the kids to don't go to this kind of play uh play to earn and uh there is a way there is a way uh with the kyc tokens and there is a a way to make some um regulation for the uh for the all the gaming and this kind of stuff um now let's just switch the conversation we're going to do a few more minutes on this and then we'll do some Q&A with you guys um let's switch the conversation now obviously artificial intelligence generative AI has taken the World by storm in the last couple of years and now ai is creating
(26:51) the possibility of hyper personalization either in gaming um certainly there there there's a quite an interesting movement towards trying to unite the worlds of AI and web 3 as well so digital assets and AI as well um verification you name it a whole bunch of things so but in the context of gaming let's let's stick with gaming where Ai and web 3 sort of meet and converge these Rivers converge um let's talk about let me firstly sort of put hyper personalization and that's going to be interesting um maybe as in terms
(27:27) of like your experience a player um and how digital assets fit into that and then and then afterwards let's talk about um how AI is going to like sort of supercharge the whole the whole ecosystem in its own right anyone got any you go I'm the person we are working on AGI and actually we have several games as well like Sophia verse you know Sophia robot she is so we are actually uh taking Humanity on our wings towards super wisdom with sopia so we we engage people uh to play with the artificial general intelligences that are smarter than
(28:05) Einstein and what's going to happen then of course many things can happen if uh artificial intelligence is being aligned and forced to be aligned to humanity as it is now yes and I call that the mocan era could you relate it to the gaming topic yes yes yeah yes then then we're we're going to accelerate those things and the alignment will be through the a game yes I mean you play you play with the agis yeah Sebastian do you have a view I think AI is a fantastic tool like it's going to increase like user generated content democratize content
(28:42) creation to pretty much everyone without and you okay I love I love it when people say things like democratized comp content creation speaking of somebody who actually does create content um now uh what do you actually mean do you mean um I'm going to use an AI agent to help me inside the game or can we get some specifics here so specifically there's two ways that AI will Impact gameplay and games how games are made the first one is like you take existing gameplay and AI is augmenting it with companion with AI agent which replace NPCs to
(29:16) bring more population in game more quests and so on so the the non-player characters become more sentient essentially exactly but still the same game set the second way the more exciting is like how it pro it brings new forms of gameplay like how he invents new rules he designed new levels new worlds that and and we can play game that's never done before so you were mentioning like dungeon and dragon like now there's like dungeon games where like the AI is the rule master of those game and it's exciting and it's just the
(29:44) first wave right okay so we just getting to Ignat do you want to you have views on this yeah I wanted to add uh I have two layers to say so first of all about the democratization you said I think that gaming with AI can become uh the the commodity I mean imagine like now everyone can create Instagram and post the photo it doesn't mean that they will be become an an influencer right the same could be in gaming everyone will be able to create but will there be new games which will be interesting probably technologically would be possible but
(30:11) will it be possible to create the narrative in this commodity Market um from the other side we're speaking about the the cyber security which we're in so there are few layers of where AI can be can be helpful definitely hyper personalization is a part of our product we have let's say on boarding with education where we hyper personalize the experience to make people like like living their life uh as as we see it another part is a a companion which definitely can be upscaled NPC but for us it's not only obsc on PC which can
(30:39) improve the gaming but it also be for us it's protection right so we want to we have we're building the system of prediction and prevention uh of the so AI can be um helpful in sort of predicting what exactly uh well the the predation pre uh grooming cyber threats oh I see so threats poti grooming or whatever okay okay that's important 100% just just one thing because you sto me one sentence yes exactly 30 seconds so what I want to say so and I wanted to finish that uh IDE yes we are using the game to engage
(31:15) people with scenarios as you said so the AI is creating scenarios and people are going to vote on those scenarios to create from knowledge graphs moral graphs so that you know and that is the idea of wisdom and that's how they we engage in towards assuming the game being designed that way I suppose anim the AI is co-designing that's the idea right oh the AI might design as much as you want different ansers sounds like shangula um animok Brands actually that's very deep I think Super interesting so we we're taking AI to to
(31:46) make it cheaper and more fun I mean cheaper power I think people understand you know generative cheaper to create right to create different levels to create the actual art and are you firing all your designers we're not actually we we did have that conversation back in invol we just making them more productive 10 fired thousands of people didn't it yeah of the GBE they I think I think we've always had a bit of an we had a big team um so you know the cheaper part I think people understand I think the more fun it was
(32:16) alluded to by the panelist um uh making NPC sent in and you know they they can create a lot more possibility is not just going to the bartender and said can I get a drink or do I walk away like you can actually have a natural npl conversation and you know there'll be more possibility we're also creating Ai avors and Gamers so you know when I get tired I don't want to be playing this like you you take over Ai and then you know they can play for you so these are all things that we actually taking to the game to make it more fun for people
(32:42) right so cheaper and fun one more thing related to like also real world impact is like now like most of the AI agent they are actually trade boats and so they actually like collect resource sell buy and use like various signal and information and data to impact the economy of certain tokens and ingame economy is the next phase after that okay um do you have a view yeah actually we are um using AI in our metaverse uh as an avatar for the professor and uh teacher on a university and uh I I believe uh we have ai now in so many
(33:19) game uh if you play Nate for Speed they they have a uh AI in the game now and uh it's not something new it's arrived yeah okay okay um we're going to I want I want you to come up with a couple of sentences two or three sentences Max about this convergence of what's going to happen so let's project forward not this year not next year maybe three year three to five years time where are we um uh in terms of this convergence of AI web 3 and games um starting right at the end and then heading towards me so where
(33:55) do you see the future going and you know in the next years we're going to live in a metaverse and we're going to live in a gaming situation yeah dude I mean VR and metaverse was like pronounced years ago uh Mark zukerberg uh spent $3 billion dollars trying to make us look like him next to a picture of the Eiffel Tower in Horizon and it didn't work and now he's trying to sell his glasses and look through our eyeballs um swe I'm not sure the metaverse is going to be super exciting but it's going to be look at
(34:27) what team I'm being rude and I interrupted but give us I interrupted yeah I'm so sorry give it look like so you know what's your future how do you envision the future oh in the morning uh when you you go to the metaverse and in the evening you go back that's it in the metaverse okay Bill very interesting I I think uh it will be the largest testb SL sandbox of how Humanity will play out right yeah because it is you games is just a mirror of what happened in the real world and you know I think as mentioned you know
(35:02) some of the you know whe whether you're greedy or you're you're Croaker or you're grifter like you know all of that will play out in the gaming world and when when you had intelligence in it I I think there's going to be a lot more possibility which is right now it's very restrictive so that's why I think it's uh it's going to be a huge experiment in terms of how Humanity will play out okay Sebastian um definitely an explosion of games that leverage blockchain technology in more or less visible ways to user like digital and virtual
(35:31) economies will expand and expand cross chain uh like financialization of the world will come from gaming and virtual world more and more jobs will come from it a virtual agent and AI is going to also contribute to like a Cambrian explosion of content production which might decrease or increase the value of it but new Talent will emerge new skill will emerge uh maybe for the next two to three years it will be complementary maybe in the next five to to 10 years it might start to replace the most skilled workers in this industry let's see but I
(36:05) stay positive around like like no I think that's a very interesting point because a lot of people are concerned about how many jobs AI is going to take but there is an alternative view which you're hinting at which is that there there may be work quote unquote work inside games to be had and done and performed assuming the AIS haven't taken all of that as well um uh Maha what's your vision of the future yes I hope it's notan in five years uh we will have AGI yeah and so co-creation with the agis of uh better ways towards the light
(36:44) this is all I have to say better scenarios in gaming and we will be immersed indeed and cyborgs as much as you don't like the glasses they will be implanted in the brains right cyborgs chips in brains my God here we go um lastly sir I hope we we'll avoid being too much into vrs and chips Etc but we might definitely uh my vision is following that uh the gaming will be democratized again so there will be people will be able to create as now they creating Vlogs on YouTube people will be able to create their own worlds
(37:15) and they will be able to create the communities around this and it can become the new medium of socialization uh and uh Community uh regarding uh I also believe that people will will value much more their their digital presence so I expect the ID the gamer ID being like kind of now we have LinkedIn for career people for people that can be this the ID with their assets and with this track record being super important and as I said I believe that uh we expect to have much more problems with cyber security and mental health issues
(37:44) and it should be focused because if we don't focus on that we can see a huge Spike and problems especially with teenagers teenagers are suspective to problems they're easy to to control they're easy to to to get steered to wrong places and yeah it should be we have Quantum so byby cyber security as we see it now no but but we that's why we have post Quantum Computing encryption already so that's like I fully agree with you thank I I refer you to hopefully there's video online yesterday of two panels I ran all about
(38:12) Quantum Computing which are very very good even though I do say so myself um right thank you very much Round of Applause for our panel please ladies and gentlemen I'm I'm going to allow five minutes or so for questions or points if you would like to make a point or question um anyone anyone would like you're all you're all you're all incredibly wowed by our panel um oh thank you so much be brilliant IGN on one of your panels uh earlier this week you were talking about how to really protect young people uh and you were talking about AI Guardians
(38:48) um making sure that parents had some kind of I guess access to an understanding predictively of how their children are going without breaching the trust of the child can you can you give it a little a little bit more insight on that yeah uh definitely thank you for the question so uh now it's technologically possible to control and to give the the full information right with parental control many apps are doing this we're against this because this actually bring this is breaking the trust because kids will not be openly
(39:14) doing what they're doing and they will not be sharing this right our vision is following our vision is to say from one side to connect uh to build the trust between kid parent and the game developer and the stakeholder uh and use AI companion to actually understand what is happening but not directly say to parent that hey your kid is doing this this and that uh so our vision is the parents are having their own dashboard with a with the AI agent which is just giving the hints where the direction where something can be wrong not like
(39:43) saying your kid want to do so site or he's bet in studies but just giving some advices like how to engage person in learning Etc so yeah the idea is to know a bit better be a companion not the not so AI companion a very good point actually and uh safeguarding is very important I think in this context last question anyone yeah I think last but the best uh the thing is when you want to involve people engage people to your platform whatever it is gaming educational whatever you need some education so uh people have uh
(40:20) most of them they don't know how to enter your metaverse for example connect valet and those steps uh I'm wondering why uh you have metaverse for example Mr M has metaverse he does educational you have game why you don't cooperate together so he can teach on his platform uh I'm I'm I'm asking my question just give me a second um he has a platform to educate people and that education will be about how to get into your meta to the gaming how is it going so I want to know the answer General general question about education
(40:58) that's it's a very good question like how you bring people in in general to the new technology it's really a matter of like Network effect and incentive uh like we there's not one single answer to that but at SBO where we first we we focus on culture we worked with top brands from music from entertainment from celebrities that engage their fans so they come for fun they stay for and exploring playing and learning more uh there's platform who have like already 100 if not billion of users which are like web to social media the LinkedIn
(41:29) Instagram Tik Tok and so on which are like and traditional gaming they are like the privilege place to look up for user attract them toward web free and then there's more Niche and collaborative effect within web free but it's already like you're trying to convert a user who's already within a web free environment to expand their knowledge so it it has proven his limits as well over the past five six years I've been in the industry to be too much self Central CED on web free alone of course we're happy to collaborate M
(41:59) sandbox has been collaborating with dozen of platform web free project done like marketing collaboration inability collaboration your content can be played both on Sandbox and in your game that's how we approach it to right great well um ladies and gentlemen um thank you so much um a round of applause for our panel um and for the moderator we have yes uh I don't no no no no no no survive Mike on a panel wow the the reason there's a reason my last name is Butcher um uh that's just a little joke now uh I hope that that was interesting and I
(42:41) think actually we really did touch on a some fascinating topics there especially how we you know I think we are we do have to realize that we are of the age where young people will be gaming and we we have a there's a duty on us to get this right and over the next few years now we're going to play another game which I like to play which is um in about 5 10 minutes now we'll start the next panel and it's going to be much more broadly about web 3 technology so please stick around for that grab a coffee and come in come in in about five
(43:15) minutes um but the game that we're play play now is turn around and talk to somebody you don't know go thank you very much thank you [Music]